Sen. Joe Manchin (D-West Virginia), a centrist and the chairman of the Senate’s Energy and Natural Resources Committee, has demanded natural gas be included in President Joe Biden’s clean energy plan.

“It has to be,” Manchin told reporters Thursday. “I am all for all of the above. I am all for clean energy, but I am also for producing the amount of energy that we need to make sure that we have reliability.”

Manchin also reaffirmed his stance on his opposition to funding low-interest loans to public companies.

“I am just not for giving public companies who have shareholders, public dollars, free, when I know they’re going to be very profitable at the end whatever we do,” the centrist said. “We might front you the money with low-interest loans, but shouldn’t we get it back when the profits start flowing so we don’t have to incur more debt.”

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Manchin has long touted fossil fuels as part of an “energy transition.”

“I believe that natural gas has an important role in the energy transition,” Manchin said at a hearing last month. “If we give them and pay them incentives to basically change their portfolio by 2030, reliability will be the loser.”

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